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Guy E. Baker talks with Jason Barnard about the Market Tune-Up.
Guy E. Baker, a Wealth and Business Coach and founder of the Wealth Teams Alliance, talks with Jason Barnard about the importance of CEOs balancing their personal brand with their corporate identity.
Guy emphasizes the balance of asking open-ended questions in a conversation while staying skilled at recognizing patterns in client behavior. He stresses that objections aren’t roadblocks but opportunities to understand better.
Guy E. Baker and Jason Barnard also discuss the importance of mutual respect and understanding between a service provider and a client. Guy highlights how the right questions can lead to better alignment and decision-making.
This is a must-watch episode for any business leader who’s thinking about long-term growth, succession, and sustainability.
What you’ll learn from Guy E. Baker
- 00:00 Guy E. Baker and Jason Barnard
- 01:15 What is Guy E. Baker’s Middle Name?
- 01:33 Where Did Guy E. Baker Derive the Title “Market Tune-Up”?
- 01:56 What was ChatGPT’s Answer When Jason Barnard Asked About Guy Eugene Baker?
- 02:27 Which Detail Did ChatGPT Get Completely Wrong About Guy E. Baker?
- 02:38 What Couldn’t ChatGPT Figure Out About Guy E. Baker Based From Jason Barnard?
- 03:51 What Approach Can a Marketer Take to Improve During a Market Tune-Up?
- 03:59 What Does the E-Myth Teach About Improving a Marketing or Sales Organization?
- 04:54 What Are the Tiny Details in a Marketing Team That Can Significantly Boost Overall Performance?
- 05:18 What is the Most Important Measure of Long-Term Success in a Marketing Organization?
- 05:33 Why Should You Keep Track of Cases or Projects Across Different Business Phases?
- 06:34 Why Should You Focus On either Attracting New Clients or Converting Those Already in Your Pipeline?
- 06:41 Where Do You Start When Deciding How to Move Prospects Forward?
- 06:45 What Key Conversion Steps Should You Track to Turn Initial Interviews Into Long-Term Clients?
- 07:33 What Part of the Client Journey Drives Profitability?
- 07:55 What Phases Might Exist When Developing Both a Personal and Company Brand?
- 08:10 Why is Reaching Out to Your Best Customers Helpful When Business Slows Down?
- 09:17 Why is Identifying a Client’s Pain More Important Than Just Offering a Solution?
- 10:10 How Can You Help Clients Recognize Their Own Pain and Problems?
- 10:22 What Kind of Pain Do Most Clients Experience When They Are in Denial?
- 10:37 What Happens When Potential Clients Don’t Realize Google and AI Are Misrepresenting Them?
- 11:08 How Can You Help People Recognize a Problem and Its Pain if They Haven’t Noticed it Yet?
- 12:47 What Question Can You Ask a CEO to Share Their Problem With Their Personal Brand and Business?
- 13:48 Why Is It Important to Balance Asking Open-Ended Questions and Speaking in a Sales Call?
- 14:01 Why is it Important Not to Always Know the Answer When Asking Questions During Fact-Finding?
- 14:39 What Patterns Can You Identify by Talking to the Right Prospects and Clients Over Time?
- 15:21 What Would Happen to the Business if the CEO Took a 6-Month Break and Wasn’t Involved in Operations?
- 15:42 Why is it Important to Have Someone on Your Team You Trust Enough to Take Your Place if Needed?
- 16:52 Why Are Most Salespeople Afraid of Objections During a Sales Conversation?
- 17:07 What Factors Determine Whether Your Services Make Sense for a Potential Client?
- 17:36 What Often Keeps Successful People From Noticing the Opportunities That Could Help Them Grow?
- 18:51 What Common Pain Points Do CEOs, Founders, and Entrepreneurs Experience?
- 22:15 What Two Decisions Should Be Made During the Opening Interview With a Potential Client?
This episode was recorded live on video April 22nd 2025
Links to pieces of content relevant to this topic:
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Guy E. Baker
Transcript from Guy E. Baker with Jason Barnard on Fastlane Founders And Legacy. Market Tune-Up
[00:00:00] Guy E. Baker: I’ll get a room of 2000 people and I’ll say, raise your hand if you think we sell solutions. And you, you almost everyone will raise their hand and they’ll say, we’ll raise your hand if you think we sell problems. And almost no one will sell that, you know, raise their hand for that. And the fact of the matter is, is that no one wants the solution until they have a problem to solve.
[00:00:23] Guy E. Baker: And nobody wants to solve the problem until the problem is causing pain. So the very first thing you’ve gotta do,
[00:00:30] Narrator: Fastlane Founders and Legacy with Jason Barnard. Each week, Jason sits down with successful entrepreneurs, CEOs and executives, and get them to share how they mastered the delicate balance between rapid growth and enduring success in the business world.
[00:00:47] Narrator: How can we quickly build a profitable business that stands at test of time and becomes our legacy? A legacy we’re proud of. Fastlane Founders and Legacy with Jason Barnard.
[00:00:59] Jason Barnard: Hi everybody and welcome to another Fastlane Founders and Legacy. I’m Jason Barnard here with a quick hello and we’re good to go.
[00:01:07] Jason Barnard: Welcome to the show, Dr. Guy Baker.
[00:01:12] Guy E. Baker: And thank you very much.
[00:01:14] Jason Barnard: How lovely. I believe your middle name is Eugene.
[00:01:17] Guy E. Baker: Eugene. It’s a family name.
[00:01:20] Jason Barnard: Brilliant, wonderful. And we’re gonna be talking about market tuneup, which is all about building a business. The, the principles behind building a business, specifically in the financial industry.
[00:01:29] Jason Barnard: And I’m hoping it’s gonna help me in the services industry too.
[00:01:33] Guy E. Baker: Yeah. So I got the title from the standpoint of an automobile. You know, when you tune up an automobile, I kind of thought if you had a marketing organization, there are probably some things you ought to do to tune it up, to be more, proficient, more efficient, more effective.
[00:01:49] Jason Barnard: And so we’re gonna be talking up, making it more effective and.
[00:01:53] Guy E. Baker: Efficient.
[00:01:54] Jason Barnard: Efficient. Brilliant. Wonderful. Before we do that, I always look at Brand SERPs, the search result for people’s names, but I decided for you to look at ChatGPT, and I asked it to tell me more about Guy Eugene Baker. And it’s got a lot of information about you, including a bachelor’s, three masters, and a doctors.
[00:02:13] Jason Barnard: Which I assume is correct. I’m not, it’s not hallucinating, is it?
[00:02:17] Guy E. Baker: No, it’s not hallucinating.
[00:02:19] Jason Barnard: Is, so all of that is true. And I asked you earlier on, do you have 12 great-grandchildren? You said, yes. So it’s got that right too. The only thing it’s got completely wrong is the photos.
[00:02:31] Guy E. Baker: I’m sorry, the what?
[00:02:32] Jason Barnard: The photos at the top. The four people at the top.
[00:02:34] Guy E. Baker: The photos, yeah.
[00:02:34] Jason Barnard: And not you.
[00:02:35] Guy E. Baker: I have no idea where they came from.
[00:02:38] Jason Barnard: So ChatGPT did an amazing job on you. Used the Wikipedia page, used your company page, managed to figure out pretty much all of your life, but it couldn’t figure out what you looked like. So that’s one of the weaknesses of AI is it can get a lot right.
[00:02:55] Jason Barnard: It can sometimes get a lot wrong, which is why, you know, you might have 14 great-grandchildren or five great-grandchildren, and ChatGPT might have been hallucinating. So I decided I would check. But with people’s faces, it seems to struggle a great deal.
[00:03:09] Guy E. Baker: Well, that’s why it’s artificial.
[00:03:12] Jason Barnard: Yep. And I mean, our work at Kalicube is to control what ChatGPT, Google, Google Gemini, Copilot. Perplexity.
[00:03:20] Jason Barnard: All of these machines say about us, what they say about you when you’re not in the room. As Jeff Bezos almost said, is your personal brand. Your brand is what people are saying when you’re not in the room. In our case, your personal brand is what Google and AI are saying about you when you’re not in the room. So onto the market tune-up.
[00:03:40] Guy E. Baker: Yes.
[00:03:41] Jason Barnard: What kind of things can we improve? You are saying we can improve things to become more efficient, more effective. What are we looking at?
[00:03:51] Guy E. Baker: You know, I really am a strong advocate and adherent to Michael Gerber. You know, when he talks about the E-Myth. And I, I think if you take that same attitude towards a marketing organization, you know, a consulting firm, a sales organization or whatever, you know, and, and you wear the various hats.
[00:04:12] Guy E. Baker: There’s all sorts of things that are going on in that organization that maybe if you were doing it just a little bit better, you might get better results. A really good friend of mine many years ago told me about the sailing team that his friend went on, and he said they, they were the best sailing team, you know, he says, but when he got on and did the training, they just did things a little bit better than the other sailing teams that he was on, and that’s why they got first place.
[00:04:40] Guy E. Baker: So I think you can apply that same principle to running your business.
[00:04:45] Jason Barnard: Right. So the tiny details that add up to make the team as a whole more performant, what are some examples of the tiny details in a marketing team?
[00:04:54] Guy E. Baker: I’d say, you know, one example would be just your financials. You know, knowing what makes your company successful.
[00:05:02] Guy E. Baker: You know, if you look at all the factors that, that you, you have to deal with in terms of marketing. You know, the, the flow of leads, the flow of opening interviews, the flow of gathering facts, you know how you put that all together. There’s really only one thing I believe that’s a measure of your long-term success, and that’s how many cases that you have, you know, in the final phase before you actually are able to charge ’em.
[00:05:31] Guy E. Baker: You know, everything else leads up to that. So you just gotta do each of those little steps a little bit better, but you’ve gotta make sure that you keep track of all the cases that you’ve got. Like for instance, in insurance, in underwriting, in consulting, where you’re actually doing the project and maybe you’re phase billing them.
[00:05:52] Guy E. Baker: I mean, you know, it just depends on the business that you’re in. Yeah. But, but whatever that business is, the bottom line is the bottom line. And unless you can keep track of how of all the projects that you’ve got that are contributing to that bottom line, you’ll never know whether you’re on track for your goals or not.
[00:06:11] Jason Barnard: Right. I mean, we’re in phase billing. So we, we do phase billing, so we’ve got people in kind of that, some pot talking to us about whether or not they want to get on board with our services, let us look after their personal brand in Search and AI. Is, is that a part that I need to focus on first or the steps leading up to that part to fill up that pool with more people?
[00:06:34] Guy E. Baker: Well, I think it’s both right.
[00:06:35] Jason Barnard: So, but if I have to start somewhere. Do I, do I start where the people are currently sitting in the pool?
[00:06:41] Guy E. Baker: Well, if you know your statistics, you’re gonna do a much better job of running your business. So you know how many, how many initial interviews do you have to have to get somebody to say, yeah, I’d like to do it.
[00:06:53] Guy E. Baker: I’d like you to do an evaluation. And then how many evaluations do you have to do before you find. The next step, which is somebody that’s going to let you do the evaluation, and then how many of those evaluations turn into billing opportunities and turn into ongoing clients? I would think in your business, I’m just off the top of my head, not knowing much about it, there’s probably a huge correlation, if you will, between the number of people that you connect with and do one job with, and those that come back and let you do more than one job.
[00:07:31] Jason Barnard: Yep. Absolutely.
[00:07:33] Guy E. Baker: I would think that’s where your profitability is is in the conversion of one job to multiple jobs.
[00:07:39] Jason Barnard: Right. And I mean, an example there would be if we start working on somebody’s personal brand for an entrepreneur for example, or a CEO, and then potentially they say, oh, well I’d like to also look at my company, my brand, and work on that. So.
[00:07:54] Guy E. Baker: Right. And then the question is, are there, are there phases to their brand?
[00:07:59] Guy E. Baker: You know, is there, you know, getting it onto the internet might be one job. Another one, getting into social media might be one job. Getting them out to their existing client base. You know, I, I’ve always found that when people slow down, the smartest thing they can do is go back to their best customers and just talk to them and say, how are you doing?
[00:08:21] Guy E. Baker: Is there anything that I can help you with? And generally, if they’re happy with you, they’re gonna say, oh gosh, Jason, I’m so glad you called. You know, I’ve got this problem that I’m really coping with. Maybe you’ve got some insight.
[00:08:35] Jason Barnard: Right. And well, that’s another thing you just said problem. I’ve often come at this from the, the, the, the viewpoint that I have a solution to a lot, lots of different problems. And I tend to not be thinking so much about the person’s problem, but more about my solution.
[00:08:52] Guy E. Baker: Well, I’m, I’m really glad you brought that up ’cause that’s been one of my favorite subjects through the years. Okay. In fact, I wrote a book called Why People Buy. There’s a large portion of it that’s, that’s dedicated to that very topic. Okay.
[00:09:08] Jason Barnard: Right.
[00:09:08] Guy E. Baker: So I, I’ve had the, the good pleasure and opportunity and blessing of speaking all over the world to financial advisors. Okay. And, and I’ll get a room of 2000 people and I’ll say, raise your hand if you think we sell solutions. You, you almost everyone will raise their hand and they’ll say, well, raise your hand if you think we sell problems.
[00:09:30] Guy E. Baker: And almost no one will sell that, you know, raise their hand for that. And the fact of the matter is, is that no one wants the solution until they have a problem to solve. And nobody wants to solve the problem until the problem is causing pain. So the very first thing you’ve gotta do is help somebody identify the pain that the problem’s causing and gets them to internalize that to the place where they say, Jason, please fix this for me.
[00:09:58] Jason Barnard: How do you lead them down to that place? I mean, you, you need to identify what the pain is and then what the problem is. Is it better if I explain it to them or that, that they need to find it themselves?
[00:10:10] Guy E. Baker: Well, I think it’s a process. I, you know, I mean, obviously if you’ve got a toothache, you know you’ve got a problem and you’re gonna go to the dentist and you don’t care what it costs to fix it, just get that, get rid of that pain. Right?
[00:10:22] Jason Barnard: Yeah.
[00:10:22] Guy E. Baker: So, so there, there are those types of pains, but most pains are denial.
[00:10:29] Guy E. Baker: Okay. They don’t.
[00:10:29] Jason Barnard: What do you mean by that?
[00:10:31] Guy E. Baker: Well, they don’t know they have the problem.
[00:10:33] Jason Barnard: Oh, okay. So we, we have that. We have that problem. We have the problem that our potential clients don’t know they have a problem, which is.
[00:10:41] Guy E. Baker: Right.
[00:10:42] Jason Barnard: When they’re not in the room. Google and AI are misrepresenting them, and they’re potentially losing millions of dollars in deals, which is what happened to me and why I started this business.
[00:10:50] Jason Barnard: I lost a lot of money because Google was misrepresenting me. How do I get people to see that there’s a problem and that there is pain there if they haven’t already seen it?
[00:11:01] Guy E. Baker: So one of my favorite bromides is, “when in doubt, ask a question”.
[00:11:06] Jason Barnard: Oh, okay.
[00:11:07] Guy E. Baker: Okay. So what, what you need to do and what, you know, your listeners, if they, if you have any here for this, need to do is they need to know what their services are so well that they have 2, 3, 5 key questions that they can ask to get the conversation going.
[00:11:29] Guy E. Baker: That those questions then are like pulling a thread. You know, the more you pull the thread, the more the sweater unravels, right? And you get down to the problem. You know, these don’t have to be highly AI intellectual questions. They can just be a real simple question, you know, Jason, tell me about your business.
[00:11:48] Guy E. Baker: And so you tell me about your business. And then, and then I say, okay, Jason, and listening to you, it sounds to me like one of the biggest problems that you might be dealing with is getting people to recognize that they need your services. Is that true?
[00:12:02] Jason Barnard: Yes, it is.
[00:12:03] Guy E. Baker: Okay, and then you’re gonna tell me what that’s like and, and then from what you tell me.
[00:12:09] Guy E. Baker: And if you don’t, then I’m gonna encourage you to tell me, right? Then as you tell me what that’s like, then I’m going to hear things that fit my, you know, model of service.
[00:12:21] Jason Barnard: Yeah.
[00:12:21] Guy E. Baker: And then we can, we can start pulling on that strength.
[00:12:26] Jason Barnard: Okay. So, I mean, for, for me then it would be, if you are the CEO of the, the, the company and your personal brand is important to the company, you are the face of the company, people are searching your personal brand. What happens when, when that, well, when, when they do that, what is Google? What is AI saying and is it hurting your business?
[00:12:46] Guy E. Baker: Right. So if you’re more holistic than that, you know, one of the things that you could talk to them about is, you know, if you took a six month vacation today, what would happen to your company?
[00:12:58] Jason Barnard: Oh, that’s a good question.
[00:13:00] Guy E. Baker: Yeah, it is a good question.
[00:13:02] Jason Barnard: Yeah. You’re good at this.
[00:13:04] Guy E. Baker: Yeah, I hope so.
[00:13:05] Jason Barnard: A lot of experience.
[00:13:06] Guy E. Baker: We’ve been doing it 60 years.
[00:13:08] Jason Barnard: Ah, brilliant. Yep, yep. Yeah, I’ve, I’m, I’m a, I’m a, I’m an upstart. Okay. Yep. So that immediately leads me into the question is the company relies too much on my personal brand.
[00:13:19] Guy E. Baker: Right. In, in which case then where, where’s the opportunity for you?
[00:13:25] Jason Barnard: Building up the corporate brand and down the, the personal brand.
[00:13:29] Guy E. Baker: Exactly. Right.
[00:13:30] Jason Barnard: Oh, jolly good.. Oh, I like that. Okay. So you said ask questions, and a lot of people have said to me in a sales call, you should always be asking open-ended questions and you should speak very little.
[00:13:44] Jason Barnard: Is that true or should it be more balanced?
[00:13:48] Guy E. Baker: Well, I definitely think it has to be balanced. Another bromide that I’ve heard through the years that I think is true is, you know, “never ask a question you don’t know the answer to”. But you know, when you’re fact finding and you’re helping somebody discover, you know, come out of denial and discover, you know, what’s what their issues are.
[00:14:12] Guy E. Baker: You know, you, you have to have some back and forth on that, and you’re not necessarily going to know the answer. But the more skilled you are and the more experienced you are, when, when you see the patterns starting to evolve, you know where that pattern is going to go.
[00:14:28] Jason Barnard: And when you talk about patterns, it’s the more you talk to the prospects, who are the right people, the right kind of clients, the more you’re gonna see patterns. And after a while, it just becomes second nature.
[00:14:39] Guy E. Baker: Well, yeah, let’s, let’s take this conversation and talk about patterns. Okay. When you asked me a couple of minutes ago about your brand, you know, as an executive, okay, I, I, I immediately knew from that that there was a pattern of probability, high probability that you’re a sole practitioner and you don’t have people backing you up.
[00:15:06] Guy E. Baker: If you took a six month vacation, which then allowed me to ask the question, you know, what happens to your company if you take a six month vacation voluntarily or involuntarily?
[00:15:19] Jason Barnard: Yep. Very good point. Yeah, and I mean, I do have a team and they, they do the work and theoretically I could stop for six months, but what would happen to Kalicube right now is that the, the, the inflow of potential new clients into the pool who are close to conversion would probably slow down over that six month period because I’m not there anymore.
[00:15:42] Guy E. Baker: Right. But one of the patterns that emerges outta what you just said now is whether or not there’s anybody on that team that you trust enough to take your chair.
[00:15:54] Jason Barnard: Yeah. Okay. And if there isn’t, I need to start thinking about how that’s gonna happen over the coming months or years.
[00:16:00] Guy E. Baker: Exactly. Right. And you know, and I, I mean, I don’t know how old you are, but my guess is, is that you’re probably a lot closer to stepping away from your chair than you are getting into it.
[00:16:11] Guy E. Baker: So you know, you, you probably wanna think about some type of a transition strategy sooner than later.
[00:16:19] Jason Barnard: Yeah.
[00:16:20] Guy E. Baker: So those, so those are all, you know, those are all consulting project, subjects, topics that you can talk about that have patterns that can then lead to an engagement.
[00:16:32] Jason Barnard: Right. Okay. And in terms of objections, now you, you’ve started talking to me.
[00:16:39] Jason Barnard: We’ve, we’ve been talking in a sales call about my problems, and you have the solution to my problem and you can ease the pain. When I start to push back with objections, for example, the investment that’s necessary for me.
[00:16:52] Guy E. Baker: Right. So what is, you have to understand objections. Most salespeople are scared to death of objections because they realize that that’s maybe the beginning of the end of the conversation.
[00:17:04] Guy E. Baker: Okay, but that’s really not true. It can be, you know, obviously it depends on how well you’ve prospected the person, how well you’ve profiled them to understand whether or not your services make sense, which is that, so there’s a juxtaposition that takes place in every interview. Okay? So e so every interview that I, initial interview that I hold, I always start with the same question or, or statement. And that is, let me tell you why I stopped fire, or let me tell you why I wanted to see you. And then I’ll, I’ll usually follow that up by saying, one of the things, Jason, that we’ve found with almost everybody in your situation is they’re so busy being successfuland focusing on the things that they have to do to keep revenue coming in the door that they really don’t have time to pay attention to the details that are surrounding them that would make them more successful and get them to a higher plane and free up some of their time.
[00:18:02] Guy E. Baker: Have you found that to be true?
[00:18:05] Jason Barnard: Right? Yeah. My answer is of course, yes.
[00:18:08] Guy E. Baker: Yeah, sure. And everybody’s answer is gonna be yes. So what we do is we help people evaluate what their objectives are, their goals are. What they’re doing specifically to attain those goals and look for opportunities, then that can help you delegate more effectively, be more efficient with your clients and, you know, reach your goals and objectives in a, you know, at, at a higher level than you’ve ever done it before.
[00:18:36] Guy E. Baker: Now, I know that could sound like BS to you and I appreciate that, but, you know, having done this as many years as I’ve done it and you know, my track record, I think you can believe. There’s probably something here we can help you with.
[00:18:50] Jason Barnard: Yeah. And do you find that for CEOs, founders, entrepreneurs, one common pain point is not enough time. And if you can offer a service that will free up time by taking weight off their shoulders and worry off their mind, that’s always gonna be a great service for them.
[00:19:07] Guy E. Baker: Well, that’s a pattern of, of successful people because you know who, if you ask that question to somebody who is ever going to say, oh no, I’m not busy, you know, they’re never gonna say that, right?
[00:19:20] Guy E. Baker: So anyway, going back to your question about objections, right? So the, the objections are usually a request for more information.
[00:19:29] Jason Barnard: Right. Okay.
[00:19:30] Guy E. Baker: Okay. So when somebody submits an objection, the, the, the proper response to that in my mind can be either, well, that’s an interesting question, Jason. Tell me why you asked that.
[00:19:43] Guy E. Baker: Or you can say to Jason, to you, Jason, you can say, well, that’s very interesting, but I’m not sure I really understood what you meant. Could you rephrase that for me? Reframe that for me. So what happens in both of those cases is that the person then has to rethink what they said and, and say it in a different way.
[00:20:04] Guy E. Baker: And a lot of times when they hear the question in their brain, they realize it’s, it’s baloney, you know? And they become more honest. So with with an objection, what you really wanna do is you wanna engage them in a conversation about that objection and what that objection means, rather than just take it at face value.
[00:20:25] Guy E. Baker: I, I’m, I’m too busy and I don’t have enough money. Okay. Well.
[00:20:29] Jason Barnard: Yeah.
[00:20:30] Guy E. Baker: When somebody says, I’m too busy, who, the, the rule is whoever says the objection first wins. Okay? So if I’ve already said, you’re too busy being successful. Okay. And now you say, I’m too busy. What? I can just come back and say to you, well Jason, you just proved my point.
[00:20:51] Guy E. Baker: You know, you are so busy that there are things that you need to be thinking about that could possibly help you be more effective and, and may and bring more money to your bottom line so that you would have money to be able to do the things that would grow your business. So see, I, you know, I just turned that whole thing back around on where the services that we’re talking about are gonna solve the very problem you’re objecting to.
[00:21:19] Jason Barnard: Right. And if, if I then say, well, the investment is too much for me and I don’t value my time that much.
[00:21:26] Guy E. Baker: Okay, so you know the, whenever you’re in doubt, you do what?
[00:21:34] Jason Barnard: Ask a question.
[00:21:34] Guy E. Baker: That’s a question. So, I, I, you know, I heard what you said that the investment’s too much, but we haven’t really talked about what the investment is.
[00:21:41] Guy E. Baker: So are you talking about the investment of your time to figure out how to solve this or are you talking about, the fee that you might pay me in order to be able to help you come to the best conclusions on how to solve this? What, so when the investment’s too much, what do you mean exactly?
[00:21:59] Jason Barnard: Right. Okay. And then that forces them to say, well, in fact, it’s the money. At which point you can come back and presumably say, well, if I can free up time for you, you can actually spend that time usefully generating more income or revenue for your company.
[00:22:15] Guy E. Baker: Right. And you know, this is a really good time, I think, in the conversation with the client to find out whether or not you’ve really got a viable client. Because see, you know, in this opening interview, you, there’s two decisions that have to be made, right? The first decision is whether or not you wanna work with me, right?
[00:22:33] Jason Barnard: Yeah.
[00:22:34] Guy E. Baker: The second decision is I gotta decide whether I wanna work with you.
[00:22:39] Jason Barnard: Right. Yep. Which is something I think we often forget is that both people need to want to work together.
[00:22:46] Guy E. Baker: Right.
[00:22:46] Jason Barnard: And if that doesn’t happen, it’s never gonna, it’s never gonna be a happy relationship and a profitable relationship for both parties.
[00:22:53] Guy E. Baker: Right. So I can ask you a question then is, you know, when, when you’re procrastinating me and, and putting this off?
[00:23:02] Guy E. Baker: ‘Cause you don’t wanna spend the money right now, you know, is there, we, we’ve talked about what I can, what I think we can do for you and how we can help you. Is there any time in the future if you had enough money that you could see using services like ours?
[00:23:20] Jason Barnard: Okay. Yep. And now I remember that our head of sales, Leanne, pretty much explained that to me the other day and I’ve kind of forgotten it and you’ve just nailed it back into my head.
[00:23:33] Guy E. Baker: Yeah. Well, and you know, another way to frame that is, you know, if, if we’re able to do the things that I suggested that we can do and help you get to your bottom line and, and enhance it.
[00:23:45] Guy E. Baker: Is there any reason that you can think of that you wouldn’t wanna do business with us.
[00:23:50] Jason Barnard: Yeah.
[00:23:50] Guy E. Baker: With me. Because see that, that puts, it puts it right square on the line. And if they say, well, you know, the timing’s not right, or, you know, whatever answer they come up with that’s negative. Now you’re back into that position of who you know, do we really wanna do business with this person and vice versa. If, if they’re, if they really like the conversation and where this is going and they have at least come to an, an, a general understanding that they’re in denial and that they need to be doing something here, then they’re gonna say, no, I can’t think of anything. And say, okay, well then when, where would you like to start?
[00:24:28] Guy E. Baker: Where would be the, where would be the best place for you to start? Now notice, in all of my questions, I, I hope generally, I’m, I’m throwing the ball back to you. Okay. You know, I’m not answering the questions. I’m, I’m throwing the ball back to you because if you have the power and you have the self-determination, this is gonna be a good relationship.
[00:24:54] Guy E. Baker: If, if I’m having to pull you and pull you and pull you, it, it, it’s not gonna be a good relationship. So I, I have to, I have to give you the power in, in my book, Why People Buy, one of the things that I say is, is that people do what they wanna do when they wanna do it, okay? In other words, I can’t make anybody do something they don’t wanna do. So my job is to help them figure out what they wanna do, and then show them how to do it.
[00:25:27] Jason Barnard: Absolutely. In that case, that’s a great place to end it. That was a brilliant conversation. Thank you, Guy. Well that was perfect. Thank you everybody for watching. I hope you got as much out of it as I did. That was super interesting and you get the outro song.
[00:25:40] Jason Barnard: A quick goodbye to end the show. Thank you, Guy.
[00:25:46] Guy E. Baker: My pleasure. It was great to be with you. Thank you. Wonderful.
[00:25:49] Jason Barnard: Thank you so much.
[00:25:50] Narrator: Your corporate and personal brands are what Google and AI say they are. We can give you back control. Kalicube.
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